Learning double bass!

**Lee Collins** · May 6th, 2005, 04:33 PM

So, I've owned a double pedal for years, and today, believe it or not, is the first time ever I've actually sat down and tried working some things out with it. I've kinda messed around with it before, but never tried any slow exercises. Best I can do right now with any sort of evenness is 1/16ths at 80bpm. Check this 1 minute vid clip out. I was piddling around on top to see what I could do without losing the feet. Where should I go next so to speak with feet? Same thing all tempos I guess? Paradiddles? It's converted to mpeg4 lo-motion again and if you need a codec, install this, which is the one for avis from my canon digi cam. The other thing is, I hate having the hihat so far away! I'd rather have the slave pedal outside of the hihat but I don't really see a way around that because of the snare stand. I was sort of using the 2nd finger fulcrum but because I was concentrating on keeping the feet even, albeit it very slowly, I was forgetting about the moeller motion.

http://codecs.necromancers.ru/download/mcjpg30.zip

http://jamesseph.phpwebhosting.com/DRuM's%20Stuff/New_Picture.avi

**Morgenthaler** · May 6th, 2005, 05:21 PM

There are many ways to go as your next (first) step.

Here are a couple of good ideas:

1.Try to practice your left pedal alone, making it do all that you would normally play with your right pedal. One way would be to work out of Colin Bailey's book with both feet.

2. Practice any cobinations that you are working on with your hands -with your feet! eg. singles, doubles (very slow at first, I know!) paradiddles, flam combinations, etc. etc.

3. Try out question-answer type of patterns, like (rh:right hand / left foot:lf etc)

rh-lh-rf-lf (and vice versa) or rh-lh-rf-lf-rf-lf(and vice versa) or rh-lh-rh-lh-rf-lf(and vice versa)

4. Dig in, and transcribe good doublebass drummers like Virgil Donati, Simon Phillips, Thomas Lang, Marco Minneman, Tim Alexander and so on, and try to play some of the stuff they are playing. This might be very hard, but at least check them out and listen to what is possible with a doublepedal/2 bassdrums. Virgil has a play-along book coming out this summer, which should be a treat. Most of these guys also have great videos out that really help getting into the ideas, and techniques.

The ONE thing I can say is the key is as with anything else in drumming. Start s-l-o-w-l-y!
With control comes speed. Best of luck.

Oh, and your timing is already very good. Stay focused! Your snare work was tight, and the doublebass singles underneath, although possibly slower than you would like (as with all of us)
were right in time still! Good job!

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ May 06, 2005 02:27 PM: Message edited by: Jeppe Morgenthaler ]</font>

**Lee Collins** · May 6th, 2005, 09:28 PM

Thanks for the advice man. Someone else mentioned that colin bailey book, so it looks like the one I need to get. [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

**davfrancis** · May 7th, 2005, 09:14 AM

Like yourself I have had a double pedal for years but have only ever dabbled in it for short periods of time - there seem to be more pressing concerns that relate more directly to the music I tend to play - mostly small group jazz, big band and rhythm and blues.

Sooooo I am by no means an expert but I found myself getting mixed results with different approaches i did however get quick results with the following:

1)Playing through the reading exercises in Buddy Rich's Snare drum rudiments book with the feet under a groove on top.

2)Printing off the first chapter of Thomas Lang's Creative Control DVD and working through all those technical exercises.

All of this I did to a click at a range of tempos and took notes on tempos etc. every day

3) coming up with some interseting grooves and licks and writing those down.

I was starting to get some really positive results with this until I became jazz-boy again and went back to the world of single pedal.

Disclaimer: My double pedal playing is not great but these defrinately helped me get from non-existent to mediocre in a short space of time with limited practice.

Afterthought. I have just realised that although I claim to play jazz I may not fulfil all the criteria listed elsewhere recently and thus may not truly be speaking the language of jazz - whatever language I am speaking it AINT the langauge of the double pedal at the moment!

**davfrancis** · May 7th, 2005, 09:18 AM

Oh I almost forgot.

4) A really good one is to get hold of either Guildhall or ABRSM snare drum Grade books and play through all of that stuff including flams, drags, rolls etc with the feet at a painfully slow speed (at first) The UK drummers who do soime teaching probably have this stuff already - not sure how widely available they are elsewhere?

**palmerlouie** · May 7th, 2005, 10:40 AM

all this is all very well, but you dont NEED to go out and buy any books.

just play singles and doubles heel down mainly (and at first). put a click on and find a tempo at which you play it evenly. gradually increase tempo until you muscles begin to ache....keep going! through this until you can no longer carry on....when u get to this point, keep going and count to 20!!!

then take a breather, and start again.

later move onto paradiddles and put backbeats ontop....this is all u need. at the beginning its just muscle development.

oh, another good one, is to play a shuffle rhythm with left foot with backbeat on top....push tempos!

**Lee Collins** · May 7th, 2005, 12:18 PM

Thanks for the tips guys. Louie, at what point should I practise heel up as well? In my clip, I'm playing heel up. Should I just practise both heel up and down as I go along or only heel down for now?

**palmerlouie** · May 7th, 2005, 04:15 PM

depends how week your feet )or left foot) is. heel down and heel up use the same muscles (when ur not using leg of course) and heel down is just a much more intense workout....i almost never PLAY heel down, but i try to practice it as much as poss.

It has taken me about a year of intense work on my feet to get them half decent. but the progress is very evident...real time even...simply because its just muscle development.

THEN, you can start working on the independence or patterns....but when u think about it, if u just work 98% on the technique....ur feet will reach a point where u can play anything rather then being locked into the usual double bass bullshit that so many people play.